Murnaghan 12.05.13 Interview with Baroness Sayeeda Warsi

ANY QUOTES USED MUST BE ATTRIBUTED TO MURNAGHAN, SKY NEWS

DERMOT MURNAGHAN: Now people in Pakistan have voted in a landmark election which will see one civilian government replaced with another. Former Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif has claimed victory. The governing party, the PPP, has made big losses so how will the election affect Britain’s relationship with Pakistan? I’m joined now from Wakefield by the Senior Foreign Office Minister and also our most senior Muslim politician of course, Baroness Warsi, a very good morning to you, Baroness Warsi. You must be heartened to see this transition to another civilian government but have you any concerns as well?

BARONESS WARSI: I have been saying now for a number of months that these elections represent a historic moment where, as you’ve just said, the power can pass from a democratically elected government to another democratically elected government and to put that into context, Dermot, in the 66 years that Pakistan has existed, 33 of it has been under military rule and I think what we have seen with these elections which a large turnout and also with the number of women and young people voting, is that democracy is starting to lay deep roots into Pakistan and that is welcome. Of course, as you said, the new government faces a number of challenges. It has real issues in relation to economic reform, there is of course an education emergency which we have been supporting through our international development programme, there are real reforms needed in relation to the energy sector and of course the continuing problem of terrorism and extremism but we look forward to engaging with the new government, as and when it’s formed, and working alongside it in these challenges.

DM: So Nawaz Sharif, you have no concerns about him given his past, the jailing, the corruption and of course it was he who was ousted by the military and they are still in the background?

BARONESS WARSI: Well if you follow Pakistani politics, Dermot, you’ll know that almost any leader of that party has at some time spent their time in jail. Tragically the country has spent 33 years under military rule, many of the main political parties have spent time outside of Pakistan but I think let’s go back to the positives in this particular election. If you look at the fact that this is probably technically one of the most sound elections that has occurred up to date, the electoral roll was probably one of the cleanest that there has been, the army did not make any attempts to take over, despite the threats of terrorism and extremism people turned out to vote. You saw a large vote within the middle classes, many women turned out to vote – I think these are all positives and I think once the new government is formed it should give them a solid base within which to start dealing with some very serious challenges that Pakistan faces.

DM: Baroness Warsi, just before we end, can I ask you about a couple of domestic issues. This so-called bedroom tax, the under occupancy charge, there is a woman on the front page of the People, I’m sure you’ve seen it today, her son claims she committed suicide because of the stress caused by it. Leaving aside the specific circumstances, do you believe that policy needs to be looked at again?

BARONESS WARSI: I think those are very tragic circumstances and certainly I think to try and link them in any way to a general discussion from politicians would be wrong and of course my thoughts and our prayers go to the family of the woman who has given up her life but I think in terms of welfare reform generally, we have been very clear that we have to have a system which is fair for all. Fair for those people who need welfare which is a safety net and will always remain so in this country but also fair for tax payers.

DM: And lastly on the issue of Europe, you are not going to get a vote in the House of Commons but what about this quote from Michael Gove, the Education Secretary, today who says if there were an in/out referendum now he’d vote out. Would you join him?

BARONESS WARSI: If you listen to what Michael was saying this morning, when he was giving the interview this morning, what he said was he felt the Prime Minister’s position was right, that we needed to go back to Europe and we needed to negotiate, that we needed to claw back some of the powers from Europe. That is the position of the majority of the Conservative party, indeed the majority of people in this country. In my last job as Conservative party chairman I would regularly take a poll at associations where I would say to people, how would you like Europe to be? Do you like the current relationship? Very few hands would go up, if any. Would you like us to be out completely? A few hands would go up. Would you like us to renegotiate? And many, many hands would go up and I think that is the position of this country, we would like to renegotiate our relationship and that is the path that the Prime Minister has set us on.

DM: I suppose nobody has questioned this, it is just symbolic of how bad, you are all accepting, you’re all saying the situation is bad and things need to be renegotiated so if it came to it, to illustrate how bad things are, if it were in/out, which way would you go?

BARONESS WARSI: I don’t think these decisions, decisions as difficult as our membership of the European Union, need to be made on a whim, they need to be made after detailed discussions, they need to be made after detailed negotiations. It is right that we are going through a balance of competencies review at the moment in government whereby area by area we are looking across government, asking people to feed into that process, to see where we can renegotiate our relationship with Europe. At the next election the Conservative party has clearly promised that in its manifesto will be the promise of a referendum on the basis of a renegotiated relationship and as far as I’m concerned I don't think it is a question of in/out, it is a question of having a better Europe, a Europe which is better for us and better for the rest of Europe and that has to be done via the negotiated process and then it needs the people of Britain to vote for it in a referendum to get the mandate at the end.

DM: Okay, Baroness Warsi, thank you very much indeed for your time.