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DERMOT MURNAGHAN:  Well, as the nation remembers Britain’s war dead today, it is hard to forget that the conflict continues.  The war in Afghanistan has lasted longer than the two World Wars of the last century put together.  More than 400 members of the UK Armed Forces have lost their lives there since 2001.  So, what did they die for?  I am joined now from Helmand Province in Afghanistan by the Defence Secretary, Philip Hammond.  A very good morning to you Secretary of State.  And as I was saying there, as in other conflicts, as we remember great sacrifice, we also ask what was achieved, and that is particularly pertinent in Afghanistan now, as the mission comes towards an end.

PHILIP HAMMOND: Well that’s right, the mission is coming towards the end of its combat phase.  We will be finished our combat role by the end of next year.  And I think there are two big achievements that we can look back on and be very proud of.  Firstly, that we removed the threat form Al Qaeda and its affiliates, operating out of what was then an ungoverned Afghanistan, against targets in the West, including targets in Britain.  We removed that threat.  And since we removed that threat we have built up the security situation in Afghanistan, we have trained up a powerful, capable, Afghan…[line breaking up]
 
DM:  Well, we do apologize there, we seem to have lost the line there with the Secretary of State, Defence Secretary Philip Hammond visiting Afghanistan at the moment…..We are going to take a short break now, we will see if we can get Philip Hammond back up on the line there from Afghanistan, but stay with us, we will be right back.
 
DM:     Welcome back, you are watching Murnaghan on Sky News, so you remember just before the break, we lost our communications with the Secretary of State for Defence, Philip Hammond, who is in Afghanistan there, and I’m glad to say it is back again.  Mr. Hammond can hear me.  And Mr. Hammond we were discussing the legacy, I suppose, in Afghanistan.  We think of other conflicts, their wars, we think of them in terms of victory of defeat.  How should we term Afghanistan?  Stale mate at the best?

PH:       Well no, we have certainly achieved two of our key objectives here.  First of all, we eliminated the threat from Al Qaeda that was a very real threat, both to Britain and to our allies, when we came into this conflict in the first place.  And we have trained up an Afghan security force, very capable, and very strong now, which will be able to ensure that in the future, after we have left, those terrorists are not able to return and organise here to strike against us in our homeland.
 
DM:     But elements of that organisation, the Taliban, the number one enemy, they are going to have some role to play in Afghanistan in the future?

PH:       I mean look, the Taliban is not Al Qaeda.  The problem that we came in here to deal with, was that the Taliban had allowed Al Qaeda, and its affiliates, a base to organise.  We have dealt with the threat from Afghanistan from Al Qaeda, and the ANSF, with ISAF support, has engaged the Taliban, and I think made it absolutely clear that the Taliban cannot win a military victory.  You are absolutely right, in the end there will have to be a political solution in Afghanistan.  There will have to be a reconciliation between those parts of the Taliban that are prepared to accept the Afghan constitution, and constitutional government in this country, and those parts that support the current government of Afghanistan.  That has to be the future.

DM:     What do you think the view will be back home, so to speak, as we are talking, as we remember the sacrifices of our Armed Forces, in particular today?  With no conflicts to focus on, do you think that somehow in a way public support might, perhaps, wain?

PH:       Well public support for the Armed Forces is at an all-time high, and obviously we would like it to stay that way, but we are realistic and we recognise that support has been won in part at least, on the back of a surge of public sympathy for the sacrifices that are being made in Afghanistan.  As we come out of Afghanistan, we are going to have to do two things.  We are going to have to explain to the public what our Armed Forces are for, when we are not involved in an operation like this.  And we are going to have to make them aware of all the things that our Armed Forces are doing day in, day out, throughout the year, to keep Britain safe, even when we are not in a conflict like this.  And secondly, we have to remind people that even when the conflict is over, the consequences of that conflict will remain with us, for every two people that have died in this conflict, there is another one who has come back to the UK missing limbs, who has to make a life for many years to come in the civilian community.  And we need the public to remember them as well as to remember those who fell.

DM:     Indeed.  Do you also think it could have an impact, as you reshape the Armed Forces, this could have an impact on your desire to recruit more reservists, which is really not on track at the moment, you are not really selling it as a proposition?

PH:       Well we have got a very ambitious target for the recruitment of reservists.  We don’t have to get to our target until 2018, so we have got a little bit of time to crank this up, and clearly we recognise there is a difficulty in explaining to people that we are expanding the reserves, that we are recruiting, both for the regular army and for the reserve forces at a time when people keep reading messages about redundancies in the Armed Forces.  So, we need to get through that, we need to get the redundancies behind us, and then we need to clearly explain what our reserve forces will be doing in the future, alongside the regulars, and how the reserve forces will provide a vital link into the community as we reshape our Armed Forces for the future, and for the challenges that will be ahead.  Because there are many challenges still out there, and there are many areas of the world that present potential threats to the UK and its allies.

DM:     And Mr. Hammond, have any of the troops that you met out there expressed any sympathies for Marine A, the Royal Marine who was convicted of murdering an injured Afghan insurgent?  There are expressions, I know you will be very aware of them, that he should receive a degree of clemency, perhaps not a mandatory life sentence?

PH:       No I haven’t heard any such suggestions here.  People here understand that part of what makes us different from the insurgence and the terrorists that we are going after, is that we maintain certain standards, and these are standards that are core to our values as a society, and core to the values of the British Armed Forces, and this is an isolated incident I believe.  One individual who has let the side down, it is not indicative of the kind of behavior that people in the British Armed Forces condone, or expect to indulge in.  And I have heard no suggestion since I’ve been here that there is any request for special treatment for anyone convicted of the crime of murder.

DM:     And one of the key aims, as you mentioned there, of the mission in Afghanistan, is to prevent terror at home, terror on the streets of the UK.  I want to ask you this, do you feel in a way that we have taken our eye off the ball, and I’m thinking in the case of the terror suspect who escaped the security services monitoring through dressing in a burka and disappearing.  Does that system, as is being suggested, need tightening up?

PH:       Well look, the security services at home, and the police, face a huge challenge monitoring very large number of potential threat streams, and we are acutely conscious that the terrorist only has to get lucky once, we have go get lucky every time.  And it is, I’m afraid inevitable, because of the large numbers of potential threats that we are monitoring and managing, it is inevitable that every now and again, one will slip through the net. When that happens, we have to learn the lessons, we have to tighten the system, but I don’t think there is anyone that would want to deliver the message that we can be 100% safe.  We have to be vigilant all the time, and our security services and police do an incredible job in keeping us safe, disrupting terrorist plots, and threats, nipping them in the bud before they become a real danger to us.  But, as I said, the terrorist only has to get lucky once.

DM:     So do you agree with the security services assessment that the Edward Snowden revelations have strengthened the terrorists’ hands, and that perhaps the Attorney General ought to look into prosecuting the journalists that published that?

PH:       Well look, two separate questions.  Have the Snowden revelations damaged our ability to fight terrorism, and keep Britain safe – undoubtedly they have.  Anything which gives away the trade craft, the methods, and the methodologies of the security services and the agencies, is of course hugely valuable to those who wish it harm.  As to whether any particular prosecution or action would make much difference, I think that is a very different issue, and it is one for the Attorney General.  But the cat is out of the bag.  The Snowden revelations have gone global.  Action against any particular media outlet in any particular country, unfortunately, is not going to reverse the damage that has been done.

DM:     Okay, and just lastly Secretary of State.  I want to ask you about the sad case of Harold Percival, the former member of Bomber Command, who sadly passed away at the age of 99 recently, and didn’t really have any close relatives.  There has been a social media campaign so people will attend his funeral tomorrow.  Do you think someone from the government ought to attend?

PH:       Well it is probably not the role of government to interfere in a private service like that, but it says something about our society that old people, and in this case somebody who is very old, who have served their country with immense dignity and honour, are lonely in their final years, to the point of maybe having nobody to attend their funeral.  What I think is great, is that society has rallied round, not the government, this is not the kind of thing that the government should be doing, but that society has rallied round and there will be people, probably hundreds of people in attendance at the funeral, and I think that says something about us as a society that we can be very proud of.

DM:     Secretary of State thank you very much indeed for your time.  Defence Secretary Philip Hammond there in Afghanistan.
 
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