ANY QUOTES USED MUST BE ATTRIBUTED TO MURNAGHAN, SKY NEWS

DERMOT MURNAGHAN: So the referendum on Scottish independence is just seven months away but almost a third of people living in Scotland are still undecided as to how they’ll vote, so the Prime Minister is taking the entire Cabinet to Scotland tomorrow for a meeting to try and shore up support and in a moment I’ll speak to the Secretary of State for Scotland, Alistair Charmichael. Well let’s say a very good morning to the Scottish Secretary, Mr Charmichael and let me ask you first of all about this Cabinet meeting then, all heading up there tomorrow. Could this be a mistake? You know how Alex Salmond is going to turn this so here we have, what is it, the mainly English, mainly public school educated, mainly male, mainly middle aged, mainly white Cabinet coming here to lecture us Scots about independence.

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: Look, I am neither English nor public school educated. I am proud to be part of this coalition government and I am delighted that the Cabinet is going to be in Aberdeen tomorrow because in fact we have got a great message to tell the people of Scotland. The United Kingdom economy is now turning the corner, we have growth that is taking hold and Scotland is doing very well as part of the United Kingdom. We have the second most successful part of the economy in the United Kingdom outside of London and the south-east so as we see the number of people in jobs going up and the number of people claiming benefits going down, I think there is a good message for us to be telling people tomorrow.

DM: Indeed the message is important and we’ll discuss a lot of those arguments but the presentation is important as well. I mean that of course is why the Cabinet is going there, it’s the symbolism of it and the SNP and Alex Salmond interprets it a different way. We saw what happened when the Chancellor and the Prime Minister who have already been there, he accused them of trying to bully the Scots.

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: Well just to deal with that very point, when George Osborne made his speech making it clear that he had been given advice from the Governor of the Bank of England and the Permanent Secretary to the Treasury that no future Chancellor should enter into a currency union with an independent Scotland, if that were ever to happen, then that’s exactly what he was doing, he was acting on advice. It wasn’t bullying but it is certainly not bluffing either. Nobody should vote for independence on the basis that they will continue to use the pound in an independent Scotland as part of a currency union and that’s why now, if you do look at the polling, you see that something over 60% of all Scots think that Alex Salmond has to come up with a Plan B on currency if he is to have any credibility at all.

DM: But isn’t it also bullying to go up there and say, right okay, the future of North Sea Oil production, and we know there is quite a lot more oil there still to be got out, it is getting more and more difficult to get your hands on and there is all this decommissioning that has to take place, that that can’t be done without the deep pockets of the UK Treasury and independent Scotland couldn’t afford it?

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: What we are telling people in the north-east of Scotland who have had a tremendous economic success on the back of the North Sea oil and gas industry, is that we’ve been able to do that as part of the United Kingdom, as part of a bigger economy that can withstand the shocks of a volatile international commodity and which is also now able to stand behind the industry in a more mature phase, offering opportunities for development through tax allowances and also the allowances that are being paid out for the decommissioning of some of the assets in the North Sea oil. It’s a very positive story for the oil and gas industry as part of the United Kingdom, if people want to walk away from that positive story then it is for the nationalists to explain why they should do that.

DM: And can I just ask you, Mr Charmichael, about the timing of some of this. It is still seven months away, the referendum, as we were saying in the polling the no count is slightly ahead, there are a lot of don’t knows in there, do you think you’ve deployed one of your strongest arguments a bit too early, this argument about the pound with the Governor of the Bank of England, the Chancellor, the Shadow Chancellor all joining together saying well, Scotland won’t be allowed to join the sterling zone if it is independent? Isn’t that an argument that can be eroded over the coming months?

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: Well look, the Chancellor got the advice that he got from the Governor of the Band of England, from his own Treasury officials. It would have been reckless for him, having been given that advice, not to talk about it and not to act on it. This is not just about campaign tactics, there is a lot more at play here for people in the whole of the United Kingdom, not just the people of Scotland but we have made it clear what the real situation is about the currency union, it is now for the Scottish government in the remainder of the seven months that they have in this campaign, to come up with a proposal which is realistic and workable because they have done neither so far.

DM: And doesn’t this Cabinet trip also beg that question once again, another thing that Alex Salmond is deploying, why don’t you debate with me? I know that the Scottish Cabinet is going to be meeting not too very far away, why not have a discussion, a public discussion between the two gentlemen?

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: The people who should be debating here are Alex Salmond and Alistair Darling, as the head of the no campaign. We know why Alex Salmond wants to call for a debate with the Prime Minister and it’s because he wants to portray this as a contest between Scotland and England. The Prime Minister has an important role in this campaign but he doesn’t have a vote, the people that should be debating it head to head in that way are the people who have got a vote and for those of us who want to remain part of the United Kingdom, to me that means self-evidently Alistair Darling.

DM: But then that leads us full circle, doesn’t it, to Mr Cameron who jets in and out of Scotland to lecture the Scots without discussing with the Scots?

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: No, no I’m sorry, I don’t accept that characterisation at all. David Cameron is Prime Minister of the whole of the United Kingdom, he cannot be in Scotland all the time any more than he can be in the south-west or the north-west or even in London all of the time. What we’ve got tomorrow is part of an on-going programme of the Cabinet visiting different parts of the country. We’ve been to Cardiff, we’ve been to Birmingham, now we’re going to Aberdeen. I think it’s great that we’re going to Aberdeen because in fact it sends a fairly powerful message that the Scottish government themselves could do with remembering sometimes and that is that there are important parts of Scotland outside Edinburgh. Too many politicians who visit Scotland think they’ve seen Scotland just because they’ve been to Edinburgh, there’s a lot more to Scotland than that. DM: Okay, last question about another Englishman joining the debate and I don’t think he even lives in the UK, he is of course David Bowie and his contribution via the BAFTA award that he won last week. Do you think it’s helpful someone like that joining your campaign?

ALISTAIR CHARMICHAEL: Look, I think it’s great, I will take support from wherever I can get it because the people who will decide this question are the people of Scotland with their votes in a referendum but this will affect people throughout the rest of the United Kingdom as well and I would love to hear more people from the north-east, the north-west, from the south-west, from Wales, from Northern Ireland saying actually we respect the right that this is Scotland’s decision to take but as part of the United Kingdom family, which has been a real success for over 300 years now, please we don’t want you to leave, we would like you to stay. That’s the message I get, I would like to hear more people saying it.

DM: Okay, Secretary of State, thank you very much for your time there. Scottish Secretary, Alistair Charmichael.