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DERMOT MURNAGHAN: Now David Cameron is firmly installed back in Downing Street of course, leading the first fully Conservative government as we’ve often been telling you, for almost two decades but with a majority of just 12 it might not be plain sailing.  After ten weeks in power the government has already retreated on fox hunting, English votes for English laws and the Human Rights Act so just how important will the Conservative back benchers be in this parliament?  Well the short answer to that one, very.  I am joined now by the veteran Conservative MP, Peter Bone and the Secretary of the 1922 Committee Nigel Evans, very good to see you both.  You two have seen it all and people think because there’s a Conservative majority, and it was such a surprise given what people expected the outcome to be, that somehow this is a safe and secure Conservative government.  As I point out there, 12 seats, it gives a great chance Nigel Evans for those that wish to cause trouble to do it and of course we’ll talk to Peter in a moment but it could disappear very quickly.

NIGEL EVANS: I was elected in 1992 and yes, I have seen it all and doing that five years under John Major and people, MPs died or worse, joined the Liberal Democrats and that majority of 21 whittled down to nothing and so in the end John Major didn’t have a majority and so with a majority of 12 anything could happen quite frankly over the next five years.  As far as I’m concerned and I’m sure it’s the same with Peter, we were both elected on the same manifesto and I think that what we’ll be focusing on over the next four to five years is to make sure that we deliver on that manifesto and I suspect when it comes to votes – unless it’s freedom votes such as the famous fox hunting one that didn’t happen last week and maybe that’s a reflection of the tight majority, then I suspect that the government will get its manifesto through.

DM: Fox hunting we will talk about in a moment, that is the parliamentary balance of power as such rather than within the Conservative party.  Within the Conservative party, as Nigel alluded to there Peter Bone, are there parallels with ’92?  A eurosceptic like you, this is a moment of maximum opportunity with a renegotiation and a referendum going on.

PETER BONE: I think the media has got it totally round the wrong way.  Early on in the new parliament the BBC did a film about me saying we’re going to be rebelling and cause enormous trouble for the government. We’ve got a Tory government that is committed to an EU referendum, we’ve got a Conservative manifesto.  There have been 49 votes in the House of Commons, I voted every time, every time for the government.  In the last parliament when it was a coalition and we had to deal with the Liberal Democrats, I rebelled 15% of the votes, that’s the difference, we have a Conservative government.  The rebellions in my view …

DM: But will you vote just because it’s now a Conservative government even if you disagree or will you continue to vote along partially with your conscience?  

PETER BONE: I think all MPs would tell you this, if there is a vote in the House of Commons first of all your put your country first, your constituents second and your party third but in the vast, vast majority of cases all three coincide and I think the problem, if there is a problem and I don’t see it, is there is going to be rebellion from people on the left of the Conservative party not happy and that’s … people opposed perhaps to policy on the European Union.  There is no indication whatsoever that people on the right are going to rebel and the great thing about David Cameron and it is something that has been missed, is that he and his government are listening to what back benchers have to say.    

DM: Has he changed?  We’re hearing he is getting around the tea rooms more, and it is partly a people business as well isn’t it, knowing their names.   

PETER BONE: It is a completely different style of government then in ’92.   

DM: But is it a different style of Prime Minister?    

PETER BONE: I think it is.  You are referring back to ’92 when we had the awful Maastricht period when it was pushed through against the will quite frankly of a lot of Conservative MPs, so much so that we even had a vote of no confidence in the government that was called by John Major himself, that’s how bad it really got.  I don’t expect to see anything like that over the next four or so years …  

DM: But a parallel you touched on that I want to pick up on from the 2010 parliament, a coalition of course and it was unpopular within a lot of the Conservative party, going into coalition, the idea that the Lib Dem tail was wagging the dog etc and the idea was that, and you used to pick up on it, that the Prime Minister was a bit remote from his party.  

NIGEL EVANS: Well I’ve got to say I didn’t sense it much then but I certainly don’t sense it now.  I’m Chairman of the North West Group of Conservative MPs and last week he called us all in to have a chat with him about all the issues that are important to us about the Northern Powerhouse and also the whips are contacting me far more asking me my opinion on legislation as it comes through.  In ’92 they’d be phoning you to make absolutely certain you were there and you were voting a certain way, now it’s asking you what your view is.  

DM: Okay, Peter Bone on this issue of Europe, we’ve got to follow this through, you think more of a rebellion on the left, if there is such a thing, on the Conservative party and that’s because you’re trying to box clever here aren’t you, you are anticipating the Prime Minister and the Chancellor coming back with everything that you want and that will make the left of the party or the wets or however to term them, that will make that unhappy.  That’s not going to happen though is it?

PETER BONE: Well I have more faith in the Prime Minister than you do and he said he is going to …

DM: It’s who they’re up against.  

PETER BONE: No, no, the Prime Minister said quite clearly a fundamental change in our relationship with Europe, we are going to put the common market at the centre of what we do, we are going to certainly restrict free movement from the European Union.  Now I think he will achieve that, he’s achieved everything…

DM: But as I mentioned in the introduction, it’s only a few weeks of the new parliament and they have backed off on reform of the Human Rights Act, that was something you wanted to see wasn’t it?

PETER BONE: You can’t do everything at once and you talked about…

DM: Do you think they’ll reboot it?

PETER BONE: Of course.  You were talking about fox hunting and what was allegedly a fox hunting bill was actually a statutory instrument on animal welfare and it was a free vote.  Now I would have liked to have seen that vote go ahead and if the government lost, the government lost.  We have got to get more used to parliament saying its view, parliament is there to scrutinise the executive it’s not to put its hand up and say everything you do, the executive, is right but we shouldn’t run away from these votes and people in my party who would have voted against the SI would have had to explain why.  

DM: You mentioned fox hunting and you mentioned parliament as a whole and of course the big difference from any time during the course of parliament is this huge block of SNP MPs and some say, I wouldn’t say it myself, seem a little opportunistic when it comes to exploiting debates that they can join in.  

NIGEL EVANS: Do you know, I think they made a mistake last week on fox hunting because it was said during one of the debates that had it gone through and had the Scot Nats abstained, a principled abstention rather than the opportunism, I’ve got a sneaking suspicion that the statutory instrument still wouldn’t have got through because there is quite a large number of people, a significant number, not a majority, on the Conservative benches that seem to be not in favour of it and with a tight majority of 12, with Sinn Fein 16, I don't think they would have got it through.  

DM: Okay, gentlemen, we have to end it there.  Thank you both very much indeed, Nigel Evans and Peter Bone.