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DERMOT MURNAGHAN: So the terror level threat in the UK as a result of the Paris attacks remains at severe following those attacks but could we see that raised in the coming weeks?  Well Sajid Javid is a Conservative cabinet minister of course, Secretary of State for Culture, Media and Sport and he joins me now, a very good morning to you, Secretary of State.  First of all, the demonstration that we’re going to see in Paris today, there is a big political presence from the United Kingdom, why is that so important?

SAJID JAVID: Can I just first start by saying that my thoughts all week have been with the victims and the family and friends of the victims of this barbaric terrorist attack.  It’s not just an attack on France but on all freedom-loving countries obviously including Britain but all civilised societies.  I think what’s going on today in France, there are predictions of over a million people coming along and also incidentally there will be similar events in London and other cities around the world, is a show by people around the world that not just are their thoughts with the families of these victims, of the people who were killed, but also that they value their way of life that is very important to them, their freedom of expression, their freedom of speech and that cannot be changed, terrorists will not censor us.

DM: And all that of course applies to the United Kingdom, do you feel the threat level that is at severe at the moment, one notch down from critical, that is being examined I suppose on an hourly basis almost.

SAJID JAVID: I think it is absolutely right to keep it examined and to keep looking at it all the time.  We have already had comments this week from the security services about how they remain vigilant, as politicians I think we have to make sure that they make those judgements, not politicians but also that we provide them with all the resources and tools that they feel are necessary in a democratic society to deal with these kinds of threats.

DM: But as far as you are party to the discussions, there is no sign that the threat level if going to be raised imminently?

SAJID JAVID: No, look, we remain vigilant at all times naturally and if the threat level changes then that’s a decision by the professionals.  What we’ve seen though in recent days as well is that through parliament we have had the Counter Terrorism Bill going through which I think is a demonstration of even while these acts were unfolding in Paris we were debating these issues in parliament and making sure that our security forces, our police have the tools that they need to do the job.

DM: Do we need tougher laws, do we need to clamp down, do we need the snooper’s charter, do we need full access and records kept of people’s email and online activities?

SAJID JAVID: I think most people would accept that you need to make sure that the laws that you have, some that you have relied on in the past, are kept up to date and especially in the face of modern technology.  One thing that we Conservatives have made clear is that as has been demonstrated since many terrorists or wannabe terrorists are using online communications, something that didn’t really exist 15 or 20 years ago, we need to make sure that the laws that were developed to look at communications by the security services are up to date and that is something that I think we’ve made clear should happen.  Unfortunately it’s been opposed by the Liberal Democrats but we do have widespread agreement on other measures such as this week’s Counter Terrorism Bill which will make it easier to take away the passports at airports of people that we think are going abroad to Syria or elsewhere to carry out terrorist activities.

DM: But you also have to tell the public, don’t you, as the head of MI5 did as well, that you can’t stop them all.  The attackers of Lee Rigby got through, they fell off the radar and discussions are taking place in France, in Paris, about how the attackers had been under surveillance but were dropped off.   Some might get through.

SAJID JAVID: The reality is, because we live in a free society and we all value that, in a democratic society we always have to strike the right balance between just that, people’s freedoms, and the ability of the authorities to track down people that intend to do us harm and that is always going to be a challenge, I don't think anyone has ever denied that but every time one of these atrocities takes places I think there’s always lessons to learn and I think that is one of the discussions the Prime Minister will be having in France with the President there.

DM: What are the implications in the United Kingdom though for community cohesion?  We have been hearing reports, we are hearing them this morning, of members of the Jewish community saying that they are increasing security, they’re feeling under threat and on the other side of the coin, members of the Muslim community saying well we’re a bit worried about what might happen.

SAJID JAVID: Look, I think what this has shown in Paris, it’s a reminder that these terrorists will target everyone, they target people of faith or people of no faiths, there is no one that they won’t kill if they feel those people don’t agree with their aims, they are a threat to everyone and all communities can do more to try and help and deal with terrorists, try and help track them down but I think it is absolutely fair to say that there is a special burden on Muslim communities because whether we like it or not, these terrorists call themselves Muslims and it is no good for people to say they are not Muslims, that’s what they call themselves and we have to accept that definition they apply to themselves but they do try to take what is a great peaceful religion and warp it for their own needs.

DM: But you also have to tell don’t you the majority of non-Muslims in the United Kingdom that they are not representative of Muslim thinking and that there are millions of Muslims who absolutely find it abhorrent.

SAJID JAVID: Of course, of course that is correct and as I said, these terrorists, whether they are the ones in Paris or the ones that carried out the atrocities in Peshawar in Pakistan recently when they killed over 50 schoolchildren, what’s going on with say Boko Haram in Africa right now, they all try to take what is a great religion and warp it for their own means and we mustn’t allow them to get away with that.  Not just Muslims must not allow these terrorists to get away with that but I think all people can see what these terrorists are doing and how they are trying to use this for their own warped means and that is something that just cannot happen.

DM: You must have watched with interest given your job the ‘Je Suis Charlie’ campaign, the implications for freedom of speech here and everyone standing up and saying you should be free to offend.  Do you go along with that or do we have to point out that there are actually limits as well?

SAJID JAVID: I think freedom of expression, freedom of speech is absolutely vital to any democratic society and that does include the right to say something, whether it is through a cartoon or the written word or other means, you will offend someone.  When I read something in a newspaper that I don’t like I put it aside.  If I don’t like something on the TV – and it’s never your show by the way – I will switch the channel, that is how you work in a democratic society.  If you want the freedoms for yourself you also have to accept that they belong to everyone.

DM: But I’ve picked up a couple of examples, we’ve seen encroachment into that area, people getting offended, particularly the policing of social media.  I’m think of the columnist – shall I call her that – Katie Hopkins, making some rather not very good joke about Scottish people and Ebola victims being investigated for hate crimes.  Surely she’s got a right to offend people?

SAJID JAVID: Well I don’t know detail about that particular case but I think most people would accept in our country, just as in any free country, we have a balance of laws which are there to protect people but also to protect their right to freedom of speech and freedom of expression.  That is absolutely vital, that is something we can never let go of and we cannot allow terrorists to try and censor us.

DM: So how far, because the Archbishop of Canterbury is writing today saying there has more or less been self-censorship when it comes to the issue of the Prophet Mohammed, that there were these cartoons weren’t there, published by a Danish publication many, many years ago now and they have never really been published in the United Kingdom.  If a newspaper, a mainstream newspaper in the United Kingdom wanted to put them on the front page how far would the government go to defend them?

SAJID JAVID: Well it’s up to what a newspaper decides to do or a magazine or a TV channel for that matter, it’s up to them, it’s got nothing to do with the government and it never should have.

DM: So if they publish those cartoons or others, some of the Charlie Hebdo cartoons, if they were published in the United Kingdom and many members of the Muslim community said look, I’m not extremist but I find them offensive, what would the government’s position be?

SAJID JAVID: People can still object to something they don’t like in a paper or a magazine but that isn’t to say it can’t be published.  That is freedom, that is how it works and there is no role for government to tell any media organisation what they should or should not publish.  That is what makes us such a special society.

DM: One thing’s for sure, all this has eclipsed domestic politics for the time being and of course when the attacks happened it was just before Prime Minister’s Questions at which Mr Miliband went on the offensive about the National Health Service being in crisis.  It’s still in crisis isn’t it?

SAJID JAVID: The National Health Service clearly faces significant challenges, it has done for many years.  There is a huge increase in demand and that’s why one thing we’ve made sure is that it has got the resources to deal with that.  Funding has gone up by over 12 billion in the last four years, an extra two billion was announced just a couple of months ago.  That’s only possible by the way because we’ve got a strong economy, if we didn’t have a strong economy you wouldn’t be able to provide those resources.  It still means however there are still sometimes people that aren’t getting seen quickly enough, I have seen people, some of my own constituents, who have had to wait too long.  That’s unacceptable, it can’t happen but the only way we can deal with that is by making sure we are providing the resources and we continue to protect NHS funding, spending, and we also keep having reforms that make it more efficient.  We’ve got 5000 more doctors over the last four years, we’ve got 8000 more nurses, thousands more beds but still …

DM: But you can’t deny waiting time figures in A&E, as tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people have found out to their cost over the last few weeks, they are having to wait longer and longer to get seen and they might not get a bed even if they need one.

SAJID JAVID: Absolutely and that should be happening, everyone has a right to expect a world class health service and that’s why we spend so much time and so much money focusing on it, we all deserve it but we also can’t get away from the fact that demand is rising at a huge rate.  Two and a half thousand people each day are seen by A&E services around the country compared 2009, that also shows you how hard doctors and nurses are working and it is an opportunity also to pay our respect and dedication to them for the work that they’re doing.

DM: What do you make of Mr Miliband’s assertion today that you have not dealt with the cost of living crisis still, that many, many millions of people are still losing up to £1600 a year compared with their position in the year 2009 and he wants to change all that.

SAJID JAVID: Well the first thing I’d say is that it was during Mr Miliband’s time in office and Ed Balls and Gordon Brown that we went through the deepest recession in a hundred years so of course people were going to be hit in their pockets because of that.  Since then, under this government we’ve had the fastest growing economy of any G7 country in 2014, we have got more people employed than at any time since …

DM: But they are not better off.

SAJID JAVID: But actually wages are rising today faster than inflation and that’s been the case over the last year, in the last quarter and I believe if you look at the OBR projections that that will continue but we’ve also got the fastest rate of job generation of any major economy and that is the best way for people to ….

DM: Sajid Javid thank you very much for joining us today.  Sajid Javid, the Culture, Media and Sport Secretary.