ANY QUOTES USED MUST BE ATTRIBUTED TO MURNAGHAN, SKY NEWS

DERMOT MURNAGHAN: Now as the saying goes, what a difference an election makes.  Five years ago the Liberal Democrats were newly installed in government, now the party has just eight MPs so what does its newly elected leader have to do to turn things around?  Tim Farron joins me now from Bristol and a very good morning to you, Mr Farron.  One of the things you have to do is to take the party with you and can we get this out of the way, I know you have been asked an awful lot about it during the course of the last few days since you were elected, can you reassure gay Liberal Democrat members that you do not disapprove of their sexual practices?  

TIM FARRON: Yes, of course I can.  Let me tell you exactly what I think, I think you should have every right to love who you love, marry who you wish and I believe and support equality under law, equal dignity and that includes people whatever their sexuality.  So I am a Liberal to my fingertips and I have always thought those things.  

DM: But you are also a Christian to your fingertips and does that side, that personal side to your faith, do you or do you not think that gay sex is sinful?

TIM FARRON: Let me just say what I said again, I am absolutely clear and I can tell you what I think.  I think you should be able to love who love, marry who you wish, I believe in equality for all people no matter what their sexuality.  I know I am in a minority but I am like millions of other people in this country who go to church and I count myself as an ordinary Christian, I am not the Archbishop of Canterbury and I don’t go round making religious or theological announcements but to be absolutely clear I am somebody who is absolutely a Liberal to my fingertips believe in freedom, in equality, in everybody’s right to be treated and valued equality, with equal dignity, no matter their sexuality.

DM: But it is just the fact, and I’m sorry to go on about it, that you equivocate on this issue.  It is a straight and easy answer, is it not, do you believe – and there are an awful long list of sins, we all know that, that one of the sins is gay sex, is homosexual sexual activity?

TIM FARRON: And there’s the point, Dermot, there is a whole long list and the reality is this.  I am not a religious leader, I am the leader of the Liberal Democrats and I owe it to my party to put forward the case for Liberalism in this country and to build that movement and if I go round making one religious announcement, the next five years will be spent with me making lots more religious announcements.  The reality is I am a Christian, yes, absolutely, that is my private faith but I have just been elected to lead the Liberal fight back and what I would like to talk to you about is David Cameron’s very worrying comments about Syria overnight, about the attack on freedom of information, the selling off of Housing Association properties, that’s what I’ve been elected to talk to you about.  

DM: Well we’ll talk about Syria in just a moment but I’m sorry, but you haven’t given us a clear answer on that.  Let me turn this round and say do you find it strange that you are being asked an awful lot about this, and I am one of the ones doing this I admit that, when for instance we don’t ask our practising Muslim MPs about that particular issue about which they may have doubts.  

TIM FARRON: Sorry, say that again, did you say you don’t ask Muslim MPs this?  Is that what you said?  

DM: Yes, I can’t remember asking a practicing Muslim MP on this programme about their attitude to gay sex.  

TIM FARRON: I see your point, yes.  Well I’ve never gone around considering myself to be in a persecuted minority, I am a member of a minority and that gives me all the more respect for those people who belong to other minorities, that’s what makes a Liberal, you go out there and fight for the rights of individuals whether they belong to the minority you belong to or not because your freedoms are my freedoms.  

DM: Okay, well let’s talk about Syria, you mentioned it there and a very big looming issue.  We know the long history of the Liberal Democrats when it comes to dealing with international military activity over the past decade and a bit, how do you treat the latest pronouncement then from Mr Cameron on American television about Syria?  

TIM FARRON: I’m deeply worried by the tone of it, if I’m honest with you.  David Cameron has gone on to US television to say that he wants to help the Americans to beat ISIS, that is completely playing into the ISIS narrative.  What we need to understand, what David Cameron and indeed the Americans need to understand is that 97% of those people murdered by ISIS are Muslims and so what we really have is a war between ISIS and the Arab Muslim communities around them and if the US and David Cameron – a bit like Bush and Blair I have to say – decide to play into the ISIS narrative which they want, which is this is a cultural clash, a war of civilisations between Islam and the West, then they are completely undermining our desire to remove ISIS.  What we ought to be doing is getting behind the Muslim communities in countries within that region and supporting them through diplomatic means and others but what we must not do is ramp up the rhetoric and play into ISIS’s hands.

DM: Okay, let me ask you a question about the Labour party and of course the leadership there, could have a very big bearing on what happens in five years’ time between the Lib Dems and Labour.  Mr Corbyn in particular, I was thinking there must be an awful lot you must agree with that you hear from Jeremy Corbyn, questions about Trident, the pace of austerity – well he of course opposes it outright – and indeed welfare cut.  As I say, he is saying a lot of the things that we could hear from you.  

TIM FARRON: Well Jeremy Corbyn is a perfectly nice man, is a socialist and I am not a socialist.  He is a person who I don’t think understands, he doesn’t support measures to strengthen our economy and make sure that you balance the budget so that the country can be more prosperous.  

DM: He says he does.  

TIM FARRON: Of course with all progressives in this country there will be some area of commonality but it is not about Jeremy Corbyn, I kind of hope whoever the Labour party elects as leader – and that’s entirely in their hands and I’m not going to curse anybody by saying whether I may or may not have a preference but in the end I hope they pick somebody who is first of all not all that tribal and puts the country before the party and understands that we are in a very dangerous position in this country as the Tories solidify their position in power by pushing Scotland further and further away, either intentionally or otherwise, by solidifying their position through supporting very unfair party funding that allows the Tories to buy elections effectively and indeed boundary changes will help to entrench their position further.  People who are progressives need to understand that there will be times when we’ll need to work together and I happen to be in the West Country at this particular moment in time, down here the Labour party baldly cannot win and people who are Labour or who are Green, I really want them to see the Liberal Democrats as a progressive force that can help remove the Conservatives so whoever wins the Labour leadership I hope they will receive the occasional phone call.  

DM: So you could then five years hence, or just a little bit less, perhaps have coalition talks with Labour.  You don’t want them to be tribal and you want them to be open and receptive.  

TIM FARRON: Well I’m somebody who has always thought you need to be even handed between the other parties, not least because if you say you favour one party rather than another then you are stitching yourself up when it comes to any coalition agreement in the future but I am saying that given we have a Conservative government, a Conservative government with hardly a mandate, if you think that barely a third of people voted for them and yet they are bringing in appalling changes to our Human Rights Act, allowing your emails to be snooped on, Dermot, selling off Housing Association properties and not least what’s going on with Syria and the Freedom of Information Act being undermined, all these dramatic things which are a threat to what it is to be British, what it is to be Liberal, then certainly our focus must be in trying to fight back against that Conservative insurgency and dominance and indeed to take them down.  

DM: Okay, good talking to you Mr Farron, thank you very much indeed.  Tim Farron, the new Lib Dem leader there.  

TIM FARRON: Thank you Dermot.